On Dunbar between 43rd Avenue and Southwest Marine Drive, on both sides of the street, there are Rezoning Redevelopment signs on single family properties, and the signs depict multi-unit apartment blocks, exactly like the signs on 10th Avenue just West of Alma Street. Again, there is nothing in the area currently similar to these proposed apartment blocks, so their construction would radically decimate the existing family-oriented, single-family property community and set the precedent for more of the same. Where is the accountability to that community? What studies have been done to determine justification for the total destruction of existing neighbourhoods in favour of extreme densification at all costs? Let us not forget that it has been our City government, and its developer friends, who historically in recent decades solicited national and international immigration and investment in real estate that created the current housing crisis. It was not the fault of the majority of residents or their neighbourhoods. It is galling to the extreme that our government officials continue to make residents pay the price instead of taking responsibility for their past errors and making policy that would slow densification and plan carefully and aesthetically for the livability and satisfaction of all.
Similar survey I did in the 80's showed that the main concern with new housing in established neighbourhoods was the interruption of the existing landscape elements. One example was the harsh stone fencing delineating lot lines, with secure gating, which changed the character of the neighbourhood. 40 years on, yes it is an excellent idea to now establish current elements that should be retained for neighbourhood character in most residential areas, something you would expect to be the task of municipal planners.
About the year 2000 I worked for a firm that city planning hired to advise about "monster houses." We interviewed many residents around the city. A key and ironic finding: the gated fences you describe were seen as unneighbourly, BUT 10 foot high cedar hedges in the same location were just fine. Go figger!
Rezoning application signs posted now on 2 single family home sites (so far) in the same block, north side, of 10th Avenue (2 blocks west of Alma), showing plans for multi-storey apartment buildings. If these transformative developments proceed, the already dramatically devastated Point Grey Village neighbourhood will become another Cambie or Granville concrete corridor, another City-ordered ghetto in what was once a revered, quiet, safe family-oriented localized community of prominent, long-term, up-standing citizens. Apparently, established neighbourhoods, regardless of what they have contributed to their city or for how long, mean nothing anymore.
I am familiar with that formless rezoning proposal. The Vancouver Plan, vague though it is, could lead to what you fear. Certainly something I will be monitoring.
West Point Grey Village is as much a victim of the success of UBC's Wesbrook Mall development, and is now threatened by the Jericho Lands proposals that would simply bypass West 10th Ave.
The challenge for WPG is to identify how to accommodated a few hundred new residents each year—Apartments or condos along West 10th or elsewhere? Rowhouses or townhouses?
Thank you for the time and thought you gave to your response. The UBC Wesbrook Mall development in no way mirrors or relates to West 10th Avenue between Blanca and Alma. The obvious difference being the immediacy of the university at Wesbrook Mall, which would attract students, primarily, and professors who want to be adjacent to campus. These priorities demand smaller units, condos and townhouses, as the inhabitants would be largely singles or starter families. The West Point Grey neighbourhood, separate from UBC, has long been well-established and larger families from all walks of life, with inhabitants who value property, space and gardens for children of all ages to play and socialize safely and comfortably. I disagree with the notion that ALL neighbourhoods should accept or be required to make room for gross, extreme densification to the detriment of livability and living standards. Neighbourhoods grow and develop into unique communities that expect and nurture certain qualities that are important and desirable by that specific area. The indigenous effects on the area of Kits and West Point Grey (on the endowment lands next to University Boulevard, Jericho lands, and False Creek) is an extra complication for sure that is driving the idea of over-densification due to no necessity of public input or consultation by the indigenous tribes. It is dismaying that Vancouver residents are not more vocal and organized in their refuting of the lack of democratic process in what appears to be a "full-speed-ahead" approach to building and transforming neighbourhoods without ANY regard for the current residents or the consequences to the community's standards and expectations. Utter disrespect, total contempt and blanket disregard of local residents has been the modus operandi of previous Councils, and I fear that ABC is too weak to stand up for residents and turn the disloyalty around. If this proves to be the case, they will not last in office long.
"Norquay" is a manufactured grab out of Renfrew-Collingwood and Kensington-Cedar Cottage, bisected by one mile of Kingsway. Even after that big grab, the City of Vancouver shows no respect – https://vancouver.ca/news-calendar/areas-of-the-city.aspx – and fails to name Norquay in its gobbledygook listings. We were nothing and we have been treated as worse than nothing. Our unanticipated resistance derailed the projected further 17 "neighbourhood centres" that constituted planning agenda circa 2007. What makes "Norquay" special? Pretty well being at the geographic center of East Vancouver – handy to everywhere east of Main Street. Plus our having been targeted as ground zero for ugly value extraction, followed with contempt and disregard for promises of "payback." We lie spreadeagled on Frankenstein's table. We are the experiment where many hasty mistakes are being made. We are your future. We are in the "middle" and we are treated like we have already gone "missing." One big lesson we can share: The stacked townhouse form is an abomination when viewed from the inside. Beware. The far more attractive streetside view is designed to hoodwink the passer-by.
Joe, we have talked before about Norquay's treatment by city staff. You have reminded me that in addition to reviewing official neighbourhoods, we need to look at communities such as Norquay that either span multiple 'hoods or are special areas in them—Commercial Drive is another area that comes to mind. Thanks for that reminder.
I've lived off Commercial Drive most of my 55 years. It is a long, diverse and lively street with various businesses owned & run by shop owners. In the last 10-12 years, we have lost many of these businesses (Wonderbucks!) that made this drive, the Drive. In the last 3 months, we have lost or are losing Santa Barbara, Fets, Spank and a few more shops that I didn't visit - there are many empty windows. I also saw that El Mercato was sold and the Safeway site still looms to be too many stories over our heads. Is Commercial Drive going to end up as the eastern Broadway Plan?
At the moment, the city's planning and transportation (roads) departments both have ideas about the Drive which they have begun to share with residents. Too bad planning and Engineering are not talking or coordinating in-house about their plans.
I take longwalks with my dog in Kits. I see a lot of 3 & 4 level apt blgs. All are well cared for. These are in East Kits. In central and West Kits a lot of houses are being upgraded. I don’t know why City Planners and Councillors don’t do walking tours around neighborhoods before they give away spot rezonings to developers. Most of the houses were summer homes and are now have muli tenants. I have lived in Kits since 2000 and find people are friendly and helpful. I lived in the West End before that. I went over a couple of times since with my dog and people were not at all friendly any more since all the high rises were built. I am glad that Kits hasn’t changed with high rises.
I have talked with some of the planners who retired or were dismissed when Vision took over city hall more than a decade ago. What you describe, walking tours around neighbourhoods, was one of many things they did but are done no longer. One planner described how, every time a densification proposal came into city hall, they would set out on foot in the affected neighbourhood, look at what was there, and working. Only then would they engage with an applicant about what they were proposing.
Trees, gardens, nature and parks are what make Dunbar special. Someone once described our residential area as “the lungs of the city,” and it’s true. Walking here is like walking in a park, and the smell is of greenery. The challenge is how to keep at least some of that while increasing housing; even city staff admitted in their recent “missing middle” presentation that six units on every 50-foot lot will mean lots of trees will be lost.
On Dunbar between 43rd Avenue and Southwest Marine Drive, on both sides of the street, there are Rezoning Redevelopment signs on single family properties, and the signs depict multi-unit apartment blocks, exactly like the signs on 10th Avenue just West of Alma Street. Again, there is nothing in the area currently similar to these proposed apartment blocks, so their construction would radically decimate the existing family-oriented, single-family property community and set the precedent for more of the same. Where is the accountability to that community? What studies have been done to determine justification for the total destruction of existing neighbourhoods in favour of extreme densification at all costs? Let us not forget that it has been our City government, and its developer friends, who historically in recent decades solicited national and international immigration and investment in real estate that created the current housing crisis. It was not the fault of the majority of residents or their neighbourhoods. It is galling to the extreme that our government officials continue to make residents pay the price instead of taking responsibility for their past errors and making policy that would slow densification and plan carefully and aesthetically for the livability and satisfaction of all.
Similar survey I did in the 80's showed that the main concern with new housing in established neighbourhoods was the interruption of the existing landscape elements. One example was the harsh stone fencing delineating lot lines, with secure gating, which changed the character of the neighbourhood. 40 years on, yes it is an excellent idea to now establish current elements that should be retained for neighbourhood character in most residential areas, something you would expect to be the task of municipal planners.
About the year 2000 I worked for a firm that city planning hired to advise about "monster houses." We interviewed many residents around the city. A key and ironic finding: the gated fences you describe were seen as unneighbourly, BUT 10 foot high cedar hedges in the same location were just fine. Go figger!
Rezoning application signs posted now on 2 single family home sites (so far) in the same block, north side, of 10th Avenue (2 blocks west of Alma), showing plans for multi-storey apartment buildings. If these transformative developments proceed, the already dramatically devastated Point Grey Village neighbourhood will become another Cambie or Granville concrete corridor, another City-ordered ghetto in what was once a revered, quiet, safe family-oriented localized community of prominent, long-term, up-standing citizens. Apparently, established neighbourhoods, regardless of what they have contributed to their city or for how long, mean nothing anymore.
I am familiar with that formless rezoning proposal. The Vancouver Plan, vague though it is, could lead to what you fear. Certainly something I will be monitoring.
West Point Grey Village is as much a victim of the success of UBC's Wesbrook Mall development, and is now threatened by the Jericho Lands proposals that would simply bypass West 10th Ave.
The challenge for WPG is to identify how to accommodated a few hundred new residents each year—Apartments or condos along West 10th or elsewhere? Rowhouses or townhouses?
Thank you for the time and thought you gave to your response. The UBC Wesbrook Mall development in no way mirrors or relates to West 10th Avenue between Blanca and Alma. The obvious difference being the immediacy of the university at Wesbrook Mall, which would attract students, primarily, and professors who want to be adjacent to campus. These priorities demand smaller units, condos and townhouses, as the inhabitants would be largely singles or starter families. The West Point Grey neighbourhood, separate from UBC, has long been well-established and larger families from all walks of life, with inhabitants who value property, space and gardens for children of all ages to play and socialize safely and comfortably. I disagree with the notion that ALL neighbourhoods should accept or be required to make room for gross, extreme densification to the detriment of livability and living standards. Neighbourhoods grow and develop into unique communities that expect and nurture certain qualities that are important and desirable by that specific area. The indigenous effects on the area of Kits and West Point Grey (on the endowment lands next to University Boulevard, Jericho lands, and False Creek) is an extra complication for sure that is driving the idea of over-densification due to no necessity of public input or consultation by the indigenous tribes. It is dismaying that Vancouver residents are not more vocal and organized in their refuting of the lack of democratic process in what appears to be a "full-speed-ahead" approach to building and transforming neighbourhoods without ANY regard for the current residents or the consequences to the community's standards and expectations. Utter disrespect, total contempt and blanket disregard of local residents has been the modus operandi of previous Councils, and I fear that ABC is too weak to stand up for residents and turn the disloyalty around. If this proves to be the case, they will not last in office long.
"Norquay" is a manufactured grab out of Renfrew-Collingwood and Kensington-Cedar Cottage, bisected by one mile of Kingsway. Even after that big grab, the City of Vancouver shows no respect – https://vancouver.ca/news-calendar/areas-of-the-city.aspx – and fails to name Norquay in its gobbledygook listings. We were nothing and we have been treated as worse than nothing. Our unanticipated resistance derailed the projected further 17 "neighbourhood centres" that constituted planning agenda circa 2007. What makes "Norquay" special? Pretty well being at the geographic center of East Vancouver – handy to everywhere east of Main Street. Plus our having been targeted as ground zero for ugly value extraction, followed with contempt and disregard for promises of "payback." We lie spreadeagled on Frankenstein's table. We are the experiment where many hasty mistakes are being made. We are your future. We are in the "middle" and we are treated like we have already gone "missing." One big lesson we can share: The stacked townhouse form is an abomination when viewed from the inside. Beware. The far more attractive streetside view is designed to hoodwink the passer-by.
Joe, we have talked before about Norquay's treatment by city staff. You have reminded me that in addition to reviewing official neighbourhoods, we need to look at communities such as Norquay that either span multiple 'hoods or are special areas in them—Commercial Drive is another area that comes to mind. Thanks for that reminder.
I've lived off Commercial Drive most of my 55 years. It is a long, diverse and lively street with various businesses owned & run by shop owners. In the last 10-12 years, we have lost many of these businesses (Wonderbucks!) that made this drive, the Drive. In the last 3 months, we have lost or are losing Santa Barbara, Fets, Spank and a few more shops that I didn't visit - there are many empty windows. I also saw that El Mercato was sold and the Safeway site still looms to be too many stories over our heads. Is Commercial Drive going to end up as the eastern Broadway Plan?
At the moment, the city's planning and transportation (roads) departments both have ideas about the Drive which they have begun to share with residents. Too bad planning and Engineering are not talking or coordinating in-house about their plans.
I take longwalks with my dog in Kits. I see a lot of 3 & 4 level apt blgs. All are well cared for. These are in East Kits. In central and West Kits a lot of houses are being upgraded. I don’t know why City Planners and Councillors don’t do walking tours around neighborhoods before they give away spot rezonings to developers. Most of the houses were summer homes and are now have muli tenants. I have lived in Kits since 2000 and find people are friendly and helpful. I lived in the West End before that. I went over a couple of times since with my dog and people were not at all friendly any more since all the high rises were built. I am glad that Kits hasn’t changed with high rises.
I have talked with some of the planners who retired or were dismissed when Vision took over city hall more than a decade ago. What you describe, walking tours around neighbourhoods, was one of many things they did but are done no longer. One planner described how, every time a densification proposal came into city hall, they would set out on foot in the affected neighbourhood, look at what was there, and working. Only then would they engage with an applicant about what they were proposing.
Being near the beach and sea wall, as well as the convenience to great shops on 4th is what I enjoy about living in Kitsilano.
It's interesting to me that the only area of the 485 blocks of the Broadway Plan that hasn't been massively upzoned is 4th Avenue.
Carol, Thanks for taking the lead with comments about Dunbar-exactly what I’m hoping to see.
Trees, gardens, nature and parks are what make Dunbar special. Someone once described our residential area as “the lungs of the city,” and it’s true. Walking here is like walking in a park, and the smell is of greenery. The challenge is how to keep at least some of that while increasing housing; even city staff admitted in their recent “missing middle” presentation that six units on every 50-foot lot will mean lots of trees will be lost.